[VEHICLE] chevrolet - opel meriva 1.8 2008
-
someone that makes cars for free? i need chevrolet - opel meriva 1.8 2008 for gta v
please leave your email and if is possible another info
Thanks
-
@NicolasDomenic The chances of a user on here being able to do this type of work for free are very slim.
-
@car-mod-fan i know
-
if someone not make free i can pay 5 dollars
-
@NicolasDomenic Most people like jspeed would mostly charge around $40.00 for a vehicle to be converted from another game, and $90.00 if this certain vehicle needs to be constructed from scratch. I know, it's an unsatisfying amount for most people.
-
I contacted Kafaros but he doesn't answer, that's why I request here
-
@NicolasDomenic You can contact jspeed, he answers.
-
@car-mod-fan said in [VEHICLE] chevrolet - opel meriva 1.8 2008:
@NicolasDomenic The chances of a user on here being able to do this type of work for free are very slim.
And yet you're not supposed to make money off the copyrighted content of anyone else in a fan community, copyright includes the design of automobiles btw. I understand that Zmodeler costs money or something, and I'm sure other necessary, or ideal programs do too, and it's technically legally tenuous to do any of it - even for free - and believe me, I know, people gotta eat, but let's face facts here, communities like this tread legal water as it is, without charging people $90 fucking dollars for something they should ostensibly be offering only because they love to do it. - And no, since I've heard it said, the amount of work you personally put in has no bearing on your right to distribute the IP, so there's no, "You make it yourself and it's yours" clause in copyright. If I spend time retyping a whole novel, it's not my novel is it? If someone sues, you can defend your work as transformative, sure, and hell, if I was a lawyer, I'd even represent you for it, but ultimately taking profit for fan works is not looked upon kindly in court, where that's concerned.
So I think everyone on here can and should stop emphasizing money so much. These kinds of things could be instrumental in TakeTwo wanting the whole modding network shut down. And it's possible they received some pressure from outside forces for not reining us in.
It may not feel like it is, but it's honestly no different from taking money for writing fan fiction. It's considered a slippery slope. Those communities have been self policing for a long time, but if this is such a thing here, I feel like we're behind the times on it. Maybe a private commission, through PMs, - because why not - but I've seen "pay me and I'll do it" on these forums. And that probably shouldn't be allowed.
As fucked up as this would seem in a different context, in this context, people should be expecting to do the work for free. Not demanding payment. Maybe the Vanilla Works type stuff, but not a Chevy-Whatsa-Callit. It's just not kosher.
-
@futurestoryteller That's the problem with this community. I don't like it either, but there's nothing that we can do about it.
-
@futurestoryteller There is a confussion. Some modders abuse/overprice their work making requested mods. Use of copyright contents (99% of all modding in the history use it) is a true reality and for that, modders are free to do and release public mods, but exists difference when is a requested mod.
If you don't know how to convert any model to GTAV, ¿What to do?, the answer is look for a modder to do the task but, modding demands time and effort, so, do paid mods is not bad when we pay for the time invested to a modder. We're not paying for a copyrighted model if the price is a fair value (15 or 20 bucks for a vehicle can be a fair deal, paying $1 or $2 dollar per hour of work, not to buy a model). Some modders are skilled and capable to do works from scratch, there, a fair price can be around $90 without any doubt.
Maybe the solution is put a standar fee for requested modding, like 1 or 2 dollars per hour of work or something like that, cause is a hobby but we can support the time and effort invested without abuses by modders.
-
@MetaGTA Well, paying hookers for their "time" and not sex is a time honored legal loophole called an "escort service," but if just anyone could get away with it, then no one would ever go to jail for solicitation.
-
@MetaGTA I don't believe there's a confusion. It doesn't matter if you're not knowledge to create/convert a 3D model you "never" designed /created. Profiting with something you can convert or modify but you didn't design is illegal.
-
@futurestoryteller You are righ man
-
@futurestoryteller @dionys19 So guys, you can wait if someday your mod ideas can be accepted by any modder for free, or, learn how to mod and do your own ideas. In anyway, the sponsored modding in GTA games has been since 2005, and without it, the modding can't exists cause the main tools developers (OpenIV team and Alexander Blade-ScriptHook developer) still developing for donations done by entusiasts (I donated to them since 2010 to keep their work).
-
@MetaGTA Donating seems to be the only motivation for modders which is understandable and also something that we need to deal with.
-
@MetaGTA Le't be fair. You can donate or get donated by someone, but is not right to request or offer money in a broad sight of everyone here especially the owners of the content.
If you guys want to donate or request money or weird stuff just do it secretly through PM !
-
So much chatter already
It is very essential, to name things properly...- Paid mods created using ripped content - Yes, not cool at all. If You really wanted to start making money with that, this will just make You more unsympatethic across the other modders, definately across the standard users not to mention laws, which are totally against You! I would really suggest finding another hobby, You will never get Your time back, even if You manage to earn a couple bucks...
- Paid mods created using "scratch-made" models (fyi lazlow555 is a great artist) - Maybe not the most respectful, but 100x -times better than the first.
- Advertising paid mods on a "free" environment, such as here - So-so situation, but, by any means, never good for that specific website.
- Advertising paid mods privately (in a closed group or directly between users) - The only "right" way.
- Requesting car mods for free - You will usually do this only once (because You will most probably understand the situation, when nobody answers nothing "to-your-liking").
- Requesting car mods (in a paid form) - If 2 people keep their discussions private, no third party will ever know, what were they after.
- Requesting car mods (and replying something idiotic every time [or in this case, offering 5$ personally insults me), when somebody mentions the improbability of the matter] - Maybe time to open zModeler3 and try it Yourself?
- Requesting car mods (and supplying random 3d-models with it) - It is better than nothing, but did You acquire permission to use it? Did You check the polycount? After failing with the last two, You still want it done for free (because, dude, I found You a model)?
And as I mentioned sometime earlier, very essential to understand the juridical aspects. It is OK for You to support/donate a person. He may give You something, which he has worked on, as a gratitude. Just, I, really suggest, that in this forum, people stop using such figures in their text as "paying for a mod". You can donate to a modder and he "may find" something "interesting" for You as a "Thank You", that way, it should be much more juridically correct. People have to understand, that it is illegal to directly or remotely benefit from modding assets, which You are not permitted to.
@dionys19 said in [VEHICLE] chevrolet - opel meriva 1.8 2008:
If you guys want to donate or request money or weird stuff just do it secretly through PM !
Best sentence in the topic, so far.
-
Alright, I'll list some of the reasons why paid mods are both important and allowed on this site:
While it is very possible to create mods for very little money, either through dubious means or through the use of free/self-made 3D models, quite a lot of modders choose to purchase a royalty-free high quality 3d model, such as those from Turbosquid or Hum3d, and these cost a lot of money. While you might get someone who'll make a mod for free, you not paying them means they may not have access to a HQ 3d model of what you want them to make, and thus will have to use a cheap or freeware 3d model which can compromise on detail.
It's also worth mentioning that these 3d models aren't cheap. I'm considering learning how to make vehicle mods myself and I can see that if I were to use payware models, I'd be spending an average of £50 - £110 every time I had to purchase a new model to convert. How do you think making modifications like that would ever be profitable without either accepting donations and commissions or engaging in piracy?
It's also worth mentioning that ZModeler3 costs money too - by donating to a vehicle modder, you're supporting them in that you're providing money that can be used on new 3D models and a continued subscription to ZM3. If the modder is creating models from scratch, they're additionally paying a lot of cash into the subscriptions for the various modelling programs they might use.
Paid mod requests are basically commissions - When I donate money to someone like @FoxtrotDelta or @SkylineGTRFreak in return for making the mod I request, I'm commissioning them to make the request I came up with into a reality. This is no different to commissioning an artist to paint you a specific scene, or a company commissioning a film crew to make them an advert.
Not only are you paying the modder to create your request, you're paying them for their time. Even if you follow a tutorial (such as that made by SCRAT-TECH, which by the way is excellent if you're planning on learning how to convert 3d models to GTA V or port GTA SA and IV cars), you're still looking at anywhere between 24 hours and one week of work, if not more!!
This is time which the modder could use on making other mods, or for non-modding purposes, so your payment also serves as giving thanks to the modder for taking the time to painstakingly create your request. As above, this is no different to commissioning an artist, animator, author etc. to make a request you've come up with.
TL;DR: There are many reasons why paid modding is not only okay, but can actually be vital towards helping modders continue to produce creations for GTA V - These range from time constraints, covering the cost of models and programs required to make mods, to simply paying someone for the service they provide.
-
@futurestoryteller Well as valid as your points are, I disagree. The world is built on people making money. If I ask you to do 30-40 hours of work for me, are you going to do it for free just because It's something you're passionate about or something that's considered an art form? I doubt it. I don't know about you but I value my time and I think that if people are going to put their time and effort into something, why shouldn't they be compensated accordingly? Musicians love to play music yet you still have to pay to see them live and pay for access to the recording. The same applies here. It's a modders sole prerogative whether or not they choose to release their work for free to the public or not. I mean if you were doing a request for me, I would be more than happy to compensate you fairly for it.
What you're saying is technically true but anyone charging money on here is NOT making money from GTA, they're making money from the work that they have done. 3D Modelling, rigging, scripting etc are all real skills that exist outside of the game so why should that fact be ignored if the work is then used in a game? People aren't being charged for anything here though, this site/forum isn't an online store. If someone contacts another user here and they make an agreement then that's entirely between the 2 users concerned and no one else, so long as they're not breaking any of the forum rules in the process which in this context, they wouldn't be.
I also think you might have underestimated what's actually involved in that $90 you mentioned, that would be a full creation from start to finish of a 3D Vehicle model, to exact specification plus a conversion to GTA. That's easily 70+ hours of work and if you're familiar with freelance 3D work you'll know that's a bargain compared to the going rate for high quality 3D work (Easily $150+ for this kind of work).
There's also the fact that this post is a request and though yes, although a lot of modders here are passionate about modding the game, they may not be as passionate about building a mod to someone elses exact specifications and in that case a commission/donation is perfectly fine because It's solely the choice of the requesting party whether or not they decide to donate or commission that modder. I've seen many artists, animators, musicians and modders online working in a similar manner so It's not something exclusive to this site or even game modding.
About IP, I agree with you but the simple fact is that this community literally would not exist without that dilemma. Most of the character and vehicle models that are ported to this game are ripped from other games like Forza and yet this site hasn't been shut down. Perhaps companies enjoy the publicity of seeing artistic renditions of their products used? Afterall that is what they are, in most cases modders don't have access to exact blueprints for cars or the exact source models used in games etc.
Nearly all of the commissions I take are done through PMs and the people requesting are entirely happy with the terms otherwise they wouldn't be talking to me. It's fair enough that you don't agree with it but neither myself or any other modder taking commissions or donations is breaking any of this forum's rules.
Donation is not the only motivation for modders but you have to understand what you're actually asking for when you make a request of someone here. Believe me modders taking commissions or donations aren't here to try to take advantage of you but at the same time we modders don't want to be taken advantage of either, thus @HRH saying he would be personally insulted by someone offering him $5 for a mod (as would I).
I don't think people on here are emphasizing money as much as you think, It's just the simple fact that if you want a request to be done quickly and effectively then a commission or donation is the best way to go. There's always the option for people to learn to mod themselves as well of course if they're unhappy with the situation, or be content to wait and see if a modder does release their desired mod in time.
I apologise for the long post though especially since @HRH and @Kiryu summed up the situation so eloquently.
-
@jspeed Thanks for clearing that up for everyone, the right way.
-
@jspeed It literally makes no difference whether you agree or not, the most unambiguous form of copyright infringement is one where the accused/offending party is proven to have profited from licensed content that was not theirs to license. This is exactly the problem, you all feel entitled to compensation for hard labor, when you could use that labor to not coast off of someone else's IP for money - or do something easier, if it's such a hassle and financial drain. No one says you have to do it, you don't have to be here. That's the point, this whole fan-community thing seems to always be built on a tacit agreement to do not-for-profit fan labor, and instead people are getting caught up in excuses for why they deserve to be paid for their thing. After decades of fan self sacrifice, why is this suddenly an exception? On the off chance that a company were to bring a lawsuit against you, do you really think "Everyone rips content from other games" is a defense they're going to take seriously? Especially when not everyone is asking for money? You seem to be taking this somewhat personally, like you need to explain because you sense that I find this annoying, and you're right, I do think it's annoying, mostly because people don't understand what the hell it is they're doing here: putting whole fan networks at risk, and calling into question their own legal rights, not just the rights of GTA fans, but setting a precedent for the entire future of copyright law, and it's pretty fucking dire if people keep so obviously crossing the line.
Again, this fan thing, whatever you want to call it, it is ambiguous. The breadth of copyright and fair use is a legal gray area, every lawyer I've ever heard on the subject says that. You know what else they say? - Accepting payment has a rather harsh tendency to unambiguize it. Particularly in the eyes of the law. If any one individual wants to do that, it's really not my problem, it's your risk to take, but call me crazy when I say, I see certain shit, and I think that I really don't want sites like this to get shut down over this kind of communal incompetence. I mean Rockstar doesn't even want the Open IV team porting Red Dead and GTA IV assets to V for "free", but you think it's totally cool to take money to convert an unrelated IP's content into the game, because it took you seventy plus hours to do? So you worked hard. How does that subsume anyone else's legal rights? How does that make it a legal right of yours? To go back to the fanfiction analogy, some of these people take it very seriously. They write novel length stories online, and they do it for free, because they are aware that this is the price they pay for playing in someone else's sandbox, but the people on here have arbitrarily decided that they're special, that their time is more important, and that sends an unwitting message out into the world that we've declared war on copyright. That we have no respect for it. While we run around collectively "reporting" others for using "our mods" without permission. The irony... cannot be overstated. Neither can the potential fallout. Maybe this isn't a concern for so many of you, after the closest possible call, and largest blow to the community that has yet occurred, just a few months ago, but my thought is maybe as an entire community we should strive to have a memory that lasts longer than a goldfish.
-
@futurestoryteller I'm not taking anything personally at all, I'm just very curious as to why you've formed this opinion. No one's law suiting anyone here as of late and therefore we're not really at risk because Take Two, Rockstar and virtually every other developer/publisher that put out games that are modded know that they can't stop people from modding and that inevitably some people do take commissions and donations. I'm sure if any of them had a problem with that they'd have spoken out about it by now, don't you?
If anyone was going to be law suited here it likely would have happened already and for us it already has, the Open IV ban which failed. Plus I can guarantee you that not one modder on this site makes anywhere near enough in donations or commissions to even warrant the attention of publishers and developers anyway, even collectively It's nothing compared to the profits they make from game sales and online.
Modding is also one of the main things keeping PC gaming relevant and alive these days and after the Open IV fiasco we had, I think nearly every publisher and developer has had a stark warning of what will happen if they go against their fans and try to stop us from modding their games. We as modders are not trying to profit from their IP. The publishers and developers profit from their IP. Any modder taking requests here is offering a service not a product. So I'm not really sure why you'd compare modding GTA to retyping a novel since we're not reselling the game itself.
Take Two & Rockstar already said that they're fine with modding so long as their assets are not distributed I'm not sure what decades of fan self sacrifice you're referring to considering there's insanely more free mods etc available now compared to even a few years ago.
Not everyone is asking for money because not everyone is taking commissions and requests in their spare time here. I release some of my mods for free on this site, others I don't but that's my choice to make. Unless the owner of said unrelated content IP (probably GMC, Nissan etc) sends a lawsuit to me personally then yes it is cool for me or anyone else to take commissions to build and convert mods for this game, you might not agree with it but that's your opinion
. We're not selling GMCs or Nissans, we're not trying to profit from their IP and we're not selling GTA or Rockstar/TakeTwo's IP, we're offering our service to make these ideas for mods into a reality.If you want to pick up a guitar and play Smoke on The Water, do you have to pay Deep Purple to play it? No. If a car mechanic charges money for his services to work on a Ford, does he have to pay Ford? No. So why then is it suddenly an issue for modders offering a service for GTA?
This community isn't something new so It's already lasted a lot longer than a goldfish as you've put it. 5mods has been around since 2015 and this community has grown out of the older GTA Modding communities which have existed for more than 10 years. GTA San Andreas has been modded even more than GTA V yet there's been no insane copyright fiasco with the GTA SA modding community since 2004 so why suddenly would it become a threat to us now? Especially after Rockstar and Take Two have effectively sanctioned us to mod their games on the condition that we don't redistribute their assets. It seems like you might be exaggerating somewha, there's nothing to indicate that the future of this community will be so gloomy and should any copyright issue arise I'm sure we can collectively solve it as we did with the Open IV situation.
-
@jspeed It's not an opinion. Do what you want, it's nice to see that after TakeTwo nearly shut everything down this community literally learned nothing about how to manage itself.
-
@futurestoryteller Listen, you may have valid reasons to the situation, but I think it's best if you could just move on from this, because it's really not going anywhere.
-
@car-mod-fan Yeah, thanks for the keen insight Mr. Lukewarm
