Radio station mods, copyrighted music and moderation
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Hi folks,
With my apologies, we are changing what has been a very lax stance on radio station mods that 5Mods has had over the past few years.
Due to copyright issues, an increase in DMCA takedown requests and the fact the EU is aggressively exploring new copyright legislation that would heavily penalise community sites like 5Mods, we are no longer going to accept Radio Station mods that include any copyrighted music unless you can prove, outright, that the copyright holder has provided an open license to either you, or the general public, for their work to be used. If such proof exists you should state as such in your mod descriptions to make it easier for our moderation team to assess.
If your mod only contains music that is open source or released under an open license (e.g. creative commons) then it is legal and fine to be hosted on 5Mods. However, if your mod contains commercial music that is copyrighted (note, this basically fits almost all music you find on the internet) then it is not legal, and we can no longer allow it to be hosted on 5Mods.
Unfortunately, this means we are going to need to retrospectively reject some mods that have been available on 5Mods for a long time now. If your mod is rejected and you think it has been done in error, please contact the staff member who rejected your file and provide proof that the music you are using has open permissions and/or is not copyrighted.
Please understand that mods that contain copyrighted music, edited to work with GTA5 or not, are illegal by the letter of the law in almost every country in the world and that we, naturally, do not want to be penalised, fined or taken offline because of our wish to host these for our users.
Thank you for your understanding in this and sorry for the inconvenience caused.
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How very unfortunate. This violates our fair use of said music and our right to modify a game that we have PURCHASED. Copyright laws will eventually ban ALL mods that have any copyrighted content if you guys fall for this shitty DMCA crap.
Plus the bullshit part of all of this is that GTA V ALLOWS YOU to add your own radio station. How is that a DMCA violation? The publisher of the game is encouraging people to add their own music to the game.Please reconsider this, it could damage the GTA 5 modding community later down the line if you give in to these bullshit complaints.
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@HarleyQuinnSquad
We've left all other SA / VC / IV (already game-related radiostations) to V edits untouched until further decisions, yours slipped through accidentally
Meanwhile other self made radio-edits using protected copyrighted songs are taken down, yesOn another note, both your arguments on 'our fair use of said music' ... which doesn't include publically sharing and 'our right to modify a game that we have PURCHASED' ... which the EULA contradicts, well, I'm sorry but is not what (inter)national laws dictate afaik.
As explained above, yours is re-published
If you feel the need, use the forums and/or tag the admin Dark0Ne to discuss the matter on 'open permissions'
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@ReNNie I see. Sorry for the misunderstanding. I was told that at the moment that music that is compressed into a rpf file is still allowed. Fair use is still open to interpretation, as the courts actually have to determine what is considered fair use: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use
But that is a whole other discussion. By the way my mod is still rejected and blocked from the public mod list:
https://www.gta5-mods.com/misc/gta-vice-city-wave103-radio-station-replaces-vinewood-boulevard-radioMaybe something happened when re-publishing my mod, because it didn't work. Thanks for the reply and discussing this rather confusing issue.
EDIT: Nevermind, everything is working now and my mod is back online, Thanks!
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My mod was not added, either.
MODERATOR says that I have violated copyrights!
What rights?! When all the music the I wanted to add is freely available!
Why then other similar mods from the site are not remove?!
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@GTA_5_Maniac Same with mine most are avalible via Bandcamp or other free streaming sites
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I agree. Any music that is public domain, royalty free, or copyright free should not be removed. I don't see the problem if the music is free to begin with and available to everyone on the internet.
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Yet when I (unofficially) complained about the attitude certain modders have about charging money for modelling work, that may very well violate copyrights or trademarks, I'm verbally railroaded by the community as "entitled" for not "wanting to pay for good work" even though that's a perversion of the argument, and this kind of (fan) community is supposed to work on honor systems and self-policing, just to ensure no one gets into trouble with the law, and everything continues to operate - on any level. The reactions to this inescapable "decision" here demonstrate the kind of naivety and entitled attitude that plagues this community above others like it on the internet. Such as fan fiction communities.
In those places it's already understood that if you didn't invent the characters you're using to tell your story there's potential for copyright dispute, the argument that it's being distributed transformed, with love, and without profit motive is the key collective argument that has thus far kept those communities from coming under consistent irreparable attack by the law. If you try to charge money for unoriginal stories you're ostracized, or at the very least criticized by most of the people on them, who are only there because they love what they're doing. They want their favorite artists to make money.
As far as I can tell the equivalent to the aforementioned transgression in this community would be making Jordan's for Franklin and charging people for downloading them. It's a trademarked brand, that the company reserves the right to license to well... video games and such. And the designs, be they ones that exist in reality anyway, are copyrighted to the company, and to the shoes' original designer. I'm not saying there's no argument, or even no legal argument available to anyone who does this. People who draw or paint fan art sometimes charge money for prints or copies, and they have some legal arguments on their side, but there are others on the opposite side, and as previously stated, these disputes are handled on a case by case basis... all I'm saying is that by the typical rules of a community of this type, - one that doesn't want to be shut down like Silk Road - It doesn't matter how hard you worked on anything, it's just bad form to take money for it, if it's not original or transformative. A guy who makes Darth Vader samurai armour is copying Darth Vaders design, but he's also putting a new spin on it, and if he sells it to one person he's not putting a dent in Disney's profits anyway. That's partly how fair use for profit works.
I suggest you watch this video if the caveats confuse you:
The equivalent to this scenario (using licensed music in GTA radio stations) in a fan literature community would be taking short stories that are found in online collections, putting them into your own collection without notice, distributing them for free, and calling it fair use. One of the qualifiers of fair use is the amount of the material used, ie you are less likely to be ruled against if you use 15% of the material than you are if you use 35... if you use an entire song you've used 100%.
All I've ever tried to do here was explain why being ignorant of these facts is dangerous if you'd like 5-mods to stay afloat.
I know this is apparently going to sound crazy to you, but songs distributed on YouTube, or Spotify, or Bandcamp are not public domain, royalty, or copyright free. They are licensed to all of those platforms and all of them are designed to make the artists money. There are also no limitations on how an artist licenses their work. So even if it sounds daft: if an author says, "People can use my material, but only on Sundays, and only while wearing a tinfoil hat" they have a right to make those stipulations. So legally an artist has a right to release things for free, and then tell you you can't distribute them yourself in any form, unaltered. In fact it's written into the license agreements of tons of free software.
There's nothing the moderators can do about this, that's the important thing to remember. If you can find non-copyrighted music, trust me, you can use it.
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@HarleyQuinnSquad I'm starting to think I should just have the mod I had as a YouTube video then link it to the download
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@SLY95ZER
Unfortunately that'll still count as publication of copyrighted information. So we won't allow linking to outside repositories.Only option is using non-copyrighted music or explicitly permitted by the owner to use.
Either that or songs already available inside an rpf in previous radiostations in the GTA universe.
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@SLY95ZER I agree. Just share your Youtube channel here and we can see what mods you have. Don't link it on GTA 5 mods. I don't see the harm in that if moderators will allow that. It's just your Youtube channel link after all.
Also if you guys want a list of some websites that offer royalty free music, here are a few:
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@futurestoryteller I'm starting to think that copyright laws are getting to be too vague and broad, leaking into more content than they should. In reality it is almost physically impossible to stop EVERYONE on the internet from making some type of copyright infringement. Since the laws are so confusing it is very hard to even enforce these laws. What's next, is it considered copyright infringement to copy my games I purchased into backup copies? Is it considered copyright infringement when I use models from GTA V to make a mod? Is it considered copyright infringement if I breathe the same air as everyone else? Common man, get over the legality and lets just make some badass mods for the modding community. Rockstar has already made their money off of GTA V and I am sure all of the music that other people are using have already had their fifty seconds of fame and loads of money thrown at their feet. In my opinion copyright laws are all about greed, which unfortunately stops honest mod creators from making creative mods here on GTA 5 mods.
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@HarleyQuinnSquad said in Radio station mods, copyrighted music and moderation:
Is it considered copyright infringement if I breathe the same air as everyone else? Common man, get over the legality and lets just make some badass mods for the modding community
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@HarleyQuinnSquad said in Radio station mods, copyrighted music and moderation:
@futurestoryteller I'm starting to think that copyright laws are getting to be too vague and broad, leaking into more content than they should.
Copyright laws exist to allow content creators to defend their rights to the content they have created. There is no vagueness nor is there any sense of "leakage". There is a grey area on linking to (re)distribution, but unauthorized distribution in itself is not legal.
In reality it is almost physically impossible to stop EVERYONE on the internet from making some type of copyright infringement. Since the laws are so confusing it is very hard to even enforce these laws.
We are voluntary moderators and we want to keep 5mods afloat. Risking a fine for 5mods would be bad, and we have to take pre-emptive measures against copyrighted material being uploaded, and take them down when DMCA'd. We can not stop redistribution on channels outside of 5mods, but on 5mods itself, we do carry the responsibility to do that.
What's next, is it considered copyright infringement to copy my games I purchased into backup copies?
Depends on your local laws. As for this website, as long as you do not redistribute it here, it's fine.
Is it considered copyright infringement when I use models from GTA V to make a mod?
If you redistribute Rockstar IP, it is. This holds in general for all kinds of IP.
Is it considered copyright infringement if I breathe the same air as everyone else?
Maybe. Depends on your local law, though things that impact the physical world are generally not part of copyright, as they aren't made by an artist/developer/author/creator. Unless God™ registered the Breathe™ function which uses Air™ under copyright.
Common man, get over the legality and lets just make some badass mods for the modding community.
Mods can be made without infringing on copyright by using public domain material or to use the material under acceptable conditions, which differs per author.
Rockstar has already made their money off of GTA V
This is not related to Rockstar, more of some entity like the MPAA/Brein/whatever hunting down 5mods.
and I am sure all of the music that other people are using have already had their fifty seconds of fame and loads of money thrown at their feet.
Which is only possible if people respect the copyright and obtain the music through approved channels, be it public-domain-via-bittorrent, license-to-listen-via-spotify or nearly impossible to get.
In my opinion copyright laws are all about greed, which unfortunately stops honest mod creators from making creative mods here on GTA 5 mods.
Try this thing.
TL;DR: Try not to redistribute non-public domain on GTA5-Mods.com.
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Nice explanations, just because the law exists doesn't mean its right. I just think it is ridiculous to be targeting modders thats all. It's not like we are downloading and distributing a game or anything. You have to have GTA V in order to use these mods anyways. What is the copyright issue with that? I bought Rockstar's game so they already have my money. I say if I have authorized access to that IP through something I bought I should be able to make mods for it, plain and simple. When creators rights infringe on our rights as a gamer and a modder, that is where the problem lies. Same goes for that stupid Denuvo shit that slows down our games. It doesn't stop pirates at all, it just inconveniences the user in the long run. Copyright laws are out of control, and now they are targeting mods. Where do you draw the line? If the mods are packed in a rpf file there shouldn't be a problem to be honest. It's not like we are giving out mp3 files. Our fair use rights are at jeopardy here and I just don't want this bleeding into other modding topics like cars and map mods.
EDIT: "Copyright laws exist to allow content creators to defend their rights to the content they have created. There is no vagueness nor is there any sense of "leakage". There is a grey area on linking to (re)distribution, but unauthorized distribution in itself is not legal."
If you can show me a law where it states that distributing mods for a game that you ACTUALLY bought with your hard earned money is a crime then you have convinced me. But you won't find it, because copyright laws are vague. They are decided in court by judges. They interpret the laws where they see fit, which is why fair use is very complicated and vague as well. What I mean is that copyright laws are slowly engulfing other topics that they should not touch. I have not seen mods targeted by DMCAs, this is the first for me. But if I bought something with my hard earned money I should be able to mod it as long as I am not deliberately giving out mp3s. That is just common sense in my opinion.
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@HarleyQuinnSquad I agree 100%
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@HarleyQuinnSquad said in Radio station mods, copyrighted music and moderation:
They are decided in court by judges
not even that as the risks are too high, so in most cases the defendant is bullied by big law firms and threatened even before getting into court and will choose the easier path of settling
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Sounds horrible. The defendant should at least have a chance to have their point of view heard. But I guess the lesson to be learned here is if you have enough money and good lawyers you can win any case. Especially if you bully your way to winning one, so disgusting.
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Never understood such mods to begin with. Like, I don't know what I already like, and cannot make my own, LOL. Frankly, I couldn't be happier to see this become a thing - this site has more than enough BS-clutter to have to wade through as it is.
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@eshenk And it's negative people like you that make people quit at adding stuff they want in game your attitude towards others is incrediblly hostile and mean for no reason other than just to be quite nasty I don't know how you became unbanned but the sooneryouget it back the better
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The DMCA can kiss my sorry ass for removing my NRLS V2 Station, Now where the hell am i suppose to put my new stations at?
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@guy50 I agree it won't be much fuss over here but I want a new variety of tracks to choose from the current ones are so boring
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@SLY95ZER IK and i just got done with New West Coast Tracks. I'm so pissed!!!
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Just post it on Youtube and post your Youtube channel here. That way we can download it from your Youtube channel. It doesn't need to be posted on GTA 5 mods.
Or if you don't have Youtube you can post it on GTA forums instead: https://gtaforums.com/forum/370-gta-v/
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@HarleyQuinnSquad said in Radio station mods, copyrighted music and moderation:
Just post it on Youtube and post your Youtube channel here. That way we can download it from your Youtube channel. It doesn't need to be posted on GTA 5 mods.
I don't know enough to know that this is legally valid either, so to cover my ass I'm going to say that I don't condone it - however the interesting thing about this suggestion - hypothetically - is that ethically speaking... it might pass the smell test. Specifically if YouTube's "sharing" policy allows the chosen music to be posted, as long as it's beside advertisements that draw revenue, then you've at least ensured in some sense that visitors generate some amount of money for the record label. It's far from a magic bullet though. And like the guy in the above video I can't and won't give out legal advice - and unlike the guy in the video I'm far from qualified to do so regardless.
