3. Could anyone help me with a couple of handling.meta commands?
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Could anyone help me with a couple of handling.meta commands?

  • F

    Hello,
    I have quite a few modded car addons in my game and I tend to modify their top speed, acceleration, raise suspension etc. by myself. Problem is, more than half of the cars tend to do those ridiculous wheelies if I keep the handbrake pressed and accelerate at the same time. The problem is even worse when I put on all performance upgrades on the vehicles. Can anyone point me to the commands in the handling.meta which need to be changed to completely disable the cars from doing wheelies?

    I know it's all the rage in drag racing, but I just find that stuff to be ridiculous and I really don't need to accidentally do a wheelie when I cruise around and burn some tires.

    Any help would be appreciated. I have read the handling tutorial thorougly, and though I found the commands, but changing those in any ways did not make any difference. So I am stuck, was hoping someone here could point me to the right direction.

    Sorry if I posted the topic in the wrong section or the wrong way, it's my very first post here.

    Cheers.

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    @Frostelis
    I'm not sure what this hold handbrake accelerate wheelie thing is?! :thinking: I've never experienced that
    I have a few ideas but the easiest way for me to help you is if you tell me what vehicle it happens to (one of them will do) & then also post the 'handling.meta' data you are using to Pastebin & post the link here for me to have a look at & test out in my game :thumbsup:

    It's most likely the 'y' or 'z' parameter in this line in 'handling.meta' causing it:

          <vecCentreOfMassOffset x="0.000000" y="0.000000" z="0.000000" />

    but may be a few other things at play.

    If you want to do it yourself, mess about with adding to the 'y' parameter:

    Example:

          <vecCentreOfMassOffset x="0.000000" y="0.200000" z="0.000000" />

    or taking away from the 'z' parameter:

    Example:

          <vecCentreOfMassOffset x="0.000000" y="0.000000" z="-0.200000" />

    or a combination of both etc.

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • MODERATOR

    ^ same
    you have script in for doing wheelies?

    » "if you're packin' keep it on the lee low"

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  • F

    Guys, sorry for the late reply, alright, here's one of the handling.metas

    It's the charger 69 by tkownz (I modified the acceleration and top speed as far as I know, perhaps lowered the braking power a bit).

    https://pastebin.com/NMEn9R5i

    If you hold the handbrake button while standing in place and then keep the acceleration button pressed, after you release handbrake the car will do a ridiculous wheelie (it will have the front of the car facing up in the air)

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  • F

    @ReNNie no scripts for wheelies, for sure.

    @a63nt-5m1th I failed to tag you on my other reply. I posted the handling.

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    @Frostelis
    I installed the add-on version of tk0wnz's 69 Charger, installed your modded handling from the Pastebin link above, got in-game, held handbrake, gunned the gas, released handbrake, no wheelie :slight_frown:, just a normal takeoff with wheels spinning?! :thinking:

    Turns out this new wheelie functionality was just added to the game in a recent update (~Nov/Dec 2018 is when people online started talking about it. Not sure the name of the update etc). I don't update my game because I don't believe in paying money to have someone take a dump on my doorstep so I have no valid way of testing the miriad of ways this new functionality will have undoubtedly f**ked up your experience of the game. Here is a thread about it although it's more focused on pulling a good wheelie than anything else.

    You want to look at ways of ripping that gimmicky shit out of your game but without the ability to look at the way R* implemented it I'm not going to be of much use. If you can, have a look at what the new update added & see if you can remove that part from your 'mods' folder install somehow. If they have coded changes for it into the .exe you are probably stuck with it (unless someone creates a script to fix it or you go back to an older version of the game).

    Any work-arounds I had planned are just going to mess up the handling of your vehicles for no real benefit.

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • F

    @a63nt-5m1th Ahh, now it's all clear. Damn, it's awful that they added that stuff. I mean, the car has to be specially prepared to pull off that sort of crap and my cars are just regular oldies that are a bit more tuned than regular. I guess I'm stuck with that stuff and should try not to hold the handbrake too long when I spin out or something...

    I'm not really skilled enough to understand their coding, so I'll probably won't be digging into those update files. Right now only 1/3 of my 110+ or so added cars don't do these wheelies on take off. I assume it's something related to drag speed/acceleration, because before applying performance upgrades through the trainer on the cars, the wheelie is barely noticeable(at least on some), after applying perf. upgrades it's very noticeable.

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    @Frostelis
    Yeah, you should be able to decide exactly what you do with the game you paid for. How hard would it be to implement an ON/OFF setting for it?
    Hey, wait a minute... You know what (eureka moment, something just clicked) I think I might have a solution for you :slight_smile:. I don't want to get your hopes up but I'm confident I might have just nailed it.

    Here is my logic:
    The impression I got from what I read online earlier is R* seemed to be targetting only muscle cars with this. Now, I'm not 100% sure about that, other classes of cars may be affected too but by my reckoning if there is a class of vehicle that is unaffected by the wheelie implementation (all you need is one) you may be able to edit your modded vehicles 'vehicles.meta' & change the class of the vehicle to one that doesn't have the wheelie implementation. Even if it's the plane class or something stupid etc.
    The line in 'vehicles.meta' you will be interested in looks like this:

          <vehicleClass>VC_MUSCLE</vehicleClass>

    Try changing it to these (see below) & let me know if any work :thumbsup:. I've listed them in a semi-sensible order but feel free to jump to the train one if you want. There's no way that's pulling a wheelie :slight_smile:.
    If you want a quick answer, I would try VC_VAN/UTILITY/COMMERCIAL as it is unlikely R* implemented wheelies for vans & garbage trucks etc but they are close enough to a road going car to not mess with any class specific settings like the VC_PLANE & VC_RAIL ones might :thumbsup:

          <vehicleClass>VC_SPORT_CLASSIC</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_SPORT</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_COMPACT</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_SEDAN</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_SUV</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_SUPER</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_VAN</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_UTILITY</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_COMMERCIAL</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_OFF_ROAD</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_INDUSTRIAL</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_SERVICE</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_EMERGENCY</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_MILITARY</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_PLANE</vehicleClass>

          <vehicleClass>VC_RAIL</vehicleClass>

    There are probably more classes but I'm confident most of these will work. Try them out & let us know how you get on :thumbsup:

    @ReNNie
    If this works I want a user class called 'Diagnostic God' next to my username lol :) :thumbsup:
    I totally didn't see the clues earlier either, but obviously my subconscious was working overtime on it. Just popped into my head fully formed. :thumbsup:

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • MODERATOR

    @a63nt-5m1th said in Could anyone help me with a couple of handling.meta commands?:

    I want a user class called 'Diagnostic God' next to my username

    if the board supported user classes, you'd definitely get it!

    » "if you're packin' keep it on the lee low"

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    @ReNNie
    Cheers! :slight_smile: I hope he logs in & checks the forum again lol.

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • A

    Hey guys.

    I also noticed this problem and I posted a tread in a different topic (I guess I should've posted it here). I changed the vehicle class to VC_SPORT for a Ruiner muscle car and it worked!

    I tested out launching other categories of cars like supercars, sports, coupes, and sedans and they didn't exhibit the tendency to preform a wheelie. All muscle cars have this tendency (at least the code that makes the car be classified as a muscle) for sure. Hell, I guess I can do a wheelie with a hearse now, huh?

    Here are some screenshots I took just to make the point more clear on my thread:
    https://imgur.com/a/Ao2b21E
    https://imgur.com/a/KuTBgkO

    Thanks to @a63nt-5m1th.
    -- Branden

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    @allfans26
    Aw nice one :slight_smile: Would have been total :poop: for R* to muck up Muscle cars like this with no easy fix. Cheers for testing it out & confirming it works :thumbsup:
    That's also a good point I never considered. It's most likely that those with the new update can now do wheelies in just about any vehicle just by setting it's class to 'VC_MUSCLE'. :thumbsup:
    *Leaves to see if he can wheelie a train lol (I can't test that, I don't have the update).

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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    @a63nt-5m1th

    I actually noticed something here: is this something that contributed to the wheelie tendency? This is a small code in the handling.meta file. If you go to a muscle car, Ruiner for exmaple, and go down to

      <SubHandlingData>
    <Item type="CCarHandlingData">
      <fBackEndPopUpCarImpulseMult value="0.100000" />
      <fBackEndPopUpBuildingImpulseMult value="0.030000" />
      <fBackEndPopUpMaxDeltaSpeed value="0.600000" />
    </Item>

    These are values that may contribute to this... BUT I'm not sure if this is true. I'm just throwing this out there.

    Something to note is that even though my suspicions of this specific code for subhandlingdata is plausible, I personally don't think it's the cause. My reason is I backed up my game files from months ago and I compared handling.meta file. Comparing June 2018 to the most recent December 2018 patch, I noticed the values are identical. So, if the values did have an effect, the game would've exhibited it months ago. Now, another plausible event could be that R* modified their game engine and have the data interpreted differently -- which could be why all labeled muscle cars exhibits this wheelie thing.

    If that's the case, then we literally can't do anything besides changing the values of the muscle car class to something else like VC_SPORTS -- which works well enough for me.

    Wheelie on a train.... now that's something I'd like to try! xD

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    @allfans26 said in Could anyone help me with a couple of handling.meta commands?:

    Wheelie on a train

    It's entirely possible we might be able to do it lol. I reckon they will have coded it to check if the vehicle class of the vehicle is 'VC_MUSCLE' & if so, it then engages the wheelie capability. If you fancy it, you could change the class of a non 'VC_MUSCLE' vehicle to 'VC_MUSCLE' & see if it then has wheelie capability? No worries if not, I just can't do it myself as I don't have nor want the update to mess with the damn near perfect game I've been working on for the last 2 years :slight_smile: :thumbsup:

    Yeah, that subhandling backend popup settings have always been there for some vehicles. I've been pondering those settings for 2 years now. Not sure exactly what they're for?! I've conducted a few tests but haven't been able to pinpoint what they are actually doing to the handling of the vehicle yet. Seems to be quite a subtle effect whatever it is.

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • F

    @a63nt-5m1th Oh, it's been a long time since I visited this thread. I'm glad to see your solution to the problem worked. Once I figure out how to downgrade the game back to previous patch or Alexander updates his scripthook, I'll get right to it changing the classes of the cars in vehicle metas. Yer a savior, thanks!

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    @Frostelis
    I outline a way to fix the wheelie problem quickly in a tut here. Might be of use to you when you get to it :thumbsup:

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • F

    @a63nt-5m1th Yah, I decided to do this today. It'll take a while because more than one third of the cars are classed as muscle cars in my game, but I'm glad it's possible to get rid of this "feature". Unrelated question, since you are pretty knowledgable about the game's handling files. What should I edit to stop some of my cars from spinning out so much when I use handbrake and what should be edited to make a car a bit more responsive when turning at high/max speed?

    I have made myself a list of all the spawn names and just spawning all cars, searching for poor handling and trying to fix that stuff along with the muscle classification and there are several ones that respond kind of badly. The handling meta tutorial is helpful, but only to an extent as some of the explanations aren't made. For example drag coefficiency line. Seems the lower it is, the easier it is for a car to get to max speed and generally be faster. The higher it is for some reason the harder it is for a car to get a higher max speed etc. That is not very well explained in that tutorial, as some other lines.

    Maybe there's other handling meta tutorials out there, but I only stumbled on this one:

    https://forums.gta5-mods.com/topic/3842/tutorial-handling-meta

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    @Frostelis
    @Frostelis said in Could anyone help me with a couple of handling.meta commands?:

    What should I edit to stop some of my cars from spinning out so much when I use handbrake?

    It totally depends on exactly what the vehicle is doing & what the best way to fix it is without changing the handling characteristics of the vehicle too much (unless you want to that is). GTA V handling is a near impossible thing to teach on paper.

    • Does the vehicle only spin out when using handbrake? (decrease 'fHandBrakeForce')
    • Can you steer your way out of a low speed donut without braking or cutting power? (If not, need to work on balancing 'fTractionCurveMax' & 'fTractionCurveMin' (generally, increase 'fTractionCurveMin'. This will also increase acceleration to some degree))
    • Lowering 'fTractionCurveLateral' (to a point) will make a vehicle less likely to spin out but also raising it (to a point) can also make it less likely to spin out. It all depends on what kind of handling you have in the first place (17 > 28 are good normal ranges to try anyway).
    • Increasing 'vecInertiaMultiplier's 'Z' parameter can increase control in a drift while sacrificing steering reponsivness (can be compensated for to some degree by increasing 'fSteeringLock' value or increasing lateral grip)

    You see already how complicated it could get to try to explain in detail :thumbsup: GTA V's handling is all about balance. It is very versatile though, I reckon you could re-invent any driving game you wanted using it. It has WAY more depth to it than you would ever reckon, given the vanilla handling of the game.

    @Frostelis said in Could anyone help me with a couple of handling.meta commands?:

    ...and what should be edited to make a car a bit more responsive when turning at high/max speed?

    • Easiest way is probably increasing 'fSteeringLock'. This will increase steering across the entire speed range of the vehicle. ie at lower speeds also.
    • Another solution might be editing 'fTractionBiasFront' & increasing the value slightly thus giving more grip to the front end of the car.
    • Lateral grip increase will improve steering also (raise 'fTractionCurveMax' &/or lower 'fTractionCurveLateral' &/or increase 'fTractionSpringDeltaMax' parameters).
    • Allowing the vehicle to turn quicker by decreasing 'vecInertiaMultiplier's 'z' parameter might also be used.

    Note: In one way or another ALL these changes above will alter, to some degree, the handling of the vehicle throughout it's entire speed range. 'fLowSpeedTractionLossMult' is about the only parameter that makes any distinction between low speed & top speed. It has an ever decreasing influence up to about ~70mph or there abouts.

    Basically, the games engine is so diverse that it is capable of just about any handling capability. Thus, without a starting point it's hard to predict a solution exactly. I have InversePower also, which changes my game from the standard handling, adding another layer of complexity.
    Best thing to do is get your hands dirty. Download Real Time Handling Editor v1.6.1. In 'RTHandlingEditor.ini' you change the '-1337' values to whatever you want & then hit 'O' on the keyboard (in-game) to load the settings to the car you are in.
    Note: Remember to reset the file when testing a different vehicle. Some settings (suspension related ones, I think) require you to spawn a new car. Some like 'vecInertiaMultiplier' don't work very well & in my experience needed to be edited manually with game restart (not sure if this is a common problem or just something I have learned to live with :slight_smile: ).
    Grab yourself a decent add-on vehicle & play around with the settings in-game :thumbsup: You can always get a new fresh download to revert to default or delete the add-on after. Just use it for figuring out what each parameter does & how it affects the vehicle's overall handling characteristics :thumbsup:

    Here's a quick cheat sheet to point you in the right direction:

          <fMass value="14000.000000" /> --- Mass of vehicle. ONLY used for collisions. Doesn't affect handling at all.
      <fInitialDragCoeff value="30.000000" /> --- Drag (air resistance). Raise to increase drag (slower vehicle top speed & acceleration). Lower to decrease drag (faster vehicle top speed & acceleration).
      <fPercentSubmerged value="85.000000" /> --- Percentage Submerged before vehicle gets choked & dies in water. +100 can drive underwater
      <vecCentreOfMassOffset x="0.000000" y="0.000000" z="0.000000" /> --- Mass/weight balance -  x = left to right (not sure (-)(+) Never tested. '0.000' is what you want here anyway) - y = front(+) to back(-) - z = up(+) & down(-). Lower 'z' to stop vehicle tipping over on corners

    vecCentreOfMassOffset

          <vecInertiaMultiplier x="1.000000" y="1.000000" z="3.000000" /> XYZ Inertia multiplier - Increase for slower movement on that axis (turn slower = increase 'z' parameter etc).

      <fDriveBiasFront value="1.000000" /> --- '1.0000' = FWD - '0.5000' = 4WD - '0.0000' = RWD
      <nInitialDriveGears value="1" /> - Number of gears - Raising too high (~8/9+) can cause problems
      <fInitialDriveForce value="0.060000" /> --- Power of Engine - Increases acceleration/wheelspin (depending on forward grip)
      <fDriveInertia value="1.000000" /> --- Engine Inertia - How easy/hard it is for the engine to start spinning fast/slow down - Usually left at '1.000'.

      <fClutchChangeRateScaleUpShift value="1.300000" /> --- Gear change upshift speed - Higher = Faster
      <fClutchChangeRateScaleDownShift value="1.300000" /> --- Gear change downshift speed - Higher = Faster

      <fInitialDriveMaxFlatVel value="40.000000" /> --- Top Speed potential - Not guaranteed as dependent on other settings (grip, drag, engine power etc). 

      <fBrakeForce value="0.300000" /> --- Braking Ability - Higher = Better Braking
      <fBrakeBiasFront value="0.450000" /> --- Braking Bias Front to Rear - '1.000' = only front wheels brake - '0.000' = only back wheels brake
      <fHandBrakeForce value="0.350000" /> --- Handbrake ability - Best to fine tune - Too little & handbrake won't work to create slide - Too much & car will brake too much & be too slow for good slide.

      <fSteeringLock value="30.000000" /> --- How far the steering wheels turn either way - Increase = More steering/oversteer ability.  
      <fTractionCurveMax value="1.150000" /> --- Lateral/sideways grip - Should be edited in tandem with 'fTractionCurveMin'
      <fTractionCurveMin value="0.950000" /> --- Forwards/Backwards/straight line grip - Should be edited in tandem with 'fTractionCurveMax'
      <fTractionCurveLateral value="11.000000" /> --- Lateral grip curve - ie The lateral angle of the vehicles maximum grip - 15>30 average range. Low value ('0'>'10') = driving on rails. High value ('30'+) = very drifty with wider sideways angle.
      <fTractionSpringDeltaMax value="0.100000" /> --- This is really overall grip - Increase = More grip - also controls how far below the vehicle the wheels still have grip.
      <fLowSpeedTractionLossMult value="0.000000" /> --- Low speed/takeoff grip but has small effect even up to 60>70mph - Increase = LESS grip = More wheel spin at low speeds.

      <fCamberStiffnesss value="0.000000" /> --- Camber - Lateral tilt of wheels - Affects lateral grip curve in subtle way - Range = '-1.000' > '1.000'.
      <fTractionBiasFront value="0.450000" /> --- Traction - Front to Rear - '1.000' = Max grip at front, slidy at rear - '0.000' - low grip/slidy at front, max grip at back tires - VERY Useful parameter for balancing a drift angle/smoothness.
      <fTractionLossMult value="1.000000" /> --- How much traction/grip is lost when changing surfaces (concrete, tarmac, grass etc) - Higher = More loss of grip.

      <fSuspensionForce value="4.000000" /> --- How springy the suspension is - Too high & car will be bouncy over bumps.
      <fSuspensionCompDamp value="1.500000" /> --- Dampener for compression (when wheels go up into wheel housing) - Raise to compensate for compression bottoming out.
      <fSuspensionReboundDamp value="1.500000" /> --- Dampener for rebound (when wheels bounce back & go down, away from car) - Raise to compensate for springy rebound that bounces car upwards over bumps etc. 
      <fSuspensionUpperLimit value="0.100000" /> --- How far the wheels are allowed to move up into the wheel housing
      <fSuspensionLowerLimit value="-0.100000" /> --- How far the wheels are allowed to move below the vehicle at full extension (ie hanging down).
      <fSuspensionRaise value="0.000000" /> --- Height of suspension - Increase to raise the suspension & have the car sit higher above the wheels.
      <fSuspensionBiasFront value="0.500000" /> --- Ratio of how strong the suspension is front to rear - '0.000' = Strong rear, weak front - '0.5000' = Even/Balanced - '1.0000' = Strong Front, weak rear.

      <fAntiRollBarForce value="0.000000" /> --- How the vehicle fights roll - Increase to reduce roll/make car stiffer. 
      <fAntiRollBarBiasFront value="0.000000" /> --- Ratio of antirollbarforce front to rear
      <fRollCentreHeightFront value="0.200000" /> --- Front axis height of centre of roll
      <fRollCentreHeightRear value="0.200000" /> --- Rear axis height of centre of roll

      <fCollisionDamageMult value="0.000100" /> --- How much the vehicle is damaged in a crash
      <fWeaponDamageMult value="1.000000" /> --- How much the vehicle is damaged by weapons
      <fDeformationDamageMult value="0.800000" /> --- How much the vehicle deforms in a crash
      <fEngineDamageMult value="1.500000" /> --- How much the engine is damaged when the vehicle crashes or is hit by weapons.

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • F

    @a63nt-5m1th This is awesome! Thanks so much, as I now have a basis to go from for those specific cars. Gonna do some more sharp turn tests before I engage in this. You saved me a lot of time figuring this stuff out as your handling tutorial is definitely more understandable to me and I finally have a better grasp on the more complext handling lines, can really delve into modifying some cars for more varying handling, not just carbon copies of each other, heh

    Also, redid the classes for all the muscle cars into "sport_classic" or "sport" for some. Working swell!

    I learned a lot thanks to you

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    @Frostelis
    Glad I could help :thumbsup:

    "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise." - Lewis Carroll (Alice in Wonderland)

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